During the past two days, the expression "Black Block" has been linked to mindless destruction, splits in the movement, and even "agents provocateurs". This is a report of a Black Block demo early on Friday, July 20th, which was part of the numerous attempts to breach the red zone.

blackpic2.jpg, image/jpeg, 250x333

Several hundred people from the park-campsite, east of the media centre, had planned to meet up with a Black Block march coming from the Social Centre Pinelli and then move towards the red zone together. But as Pinelli was surrounded by police and the people in there couldn´t get out, the roughly 300 people from the camp decided to move downtown alone. A powerful, impressive Black Block procession started and met up with a radical unionists demo on Buenos Aires, fairly close to the red zone. Parts of the Black Block targeted several banks and an estate agency, which had their windows smashed. In a side street, other Black Block people attacked a police barricade sealing off the red zone with stones and molotov cocktails. Police responded shooting large numbers of tear gas canisters at the crowd and then coming after the dispersing demo. Battles with the police occured on Corso Torino, which ended with both groups - police and Black Block - retreating and re-grouping elsewhere.

The common march of the 300 or so Black Block people, however, conceals the important fact that there was an important difference between the various groups that took part in the demo - a different political objective which eventually helped to split the group. The majority of Black Block people supported property damage only when it happened against important symbols of capitalism (such as banks) or against transnational corporations with a history of human rights abuses etc. For example, they smashed a window of a Lufthansa office and then wrote "Stop deportation" next to the smashed window (Lufthansa is involved in deporting refugees back to countries where they are tortured and often killed). This part of the Black Block is strictly against damaging small shops or cars. However, there was also a minority of other Black Block people who started to attack cars, shops and other property, mostly based on frustration about the difficulties of getting near the red zone. The first Black Block group did not appreciate this, tried to stop some of the destruction and eventually moved away. Similarly, another Black Block demo later on the day split up when the majority of Black Block activists no longer wanted to demonstrate together with some people who damaged anything and not just specific targets.

When talking about "the Black Block", it is important to define WHICH Black Block we mean. The majority of Black Block demonstrators target specific property but do not enagage in random destruction. Certainly, the vast majority of Black Block demonstrators are NOT infiltrators!

i don't care if you're breaking the windows of a company who's been involved in (so called) human rights abuse.
Violence brings violence and then more violence and then again more and more violence.
I don't give a fuck about different "black block" activists, they're all fuckin violents, and they'll get what they give.
A word to them: if Beretta bullets can kill, also poles, staffs and other objects in your hand can kill. So beware, you know what you give.
BTW, i don't want a world designed by these killers, i just prefer a darn world as this one, it's sure 1000 tyimes better than a world of violent bastards.
Black block = violence, violence = deaths, injureds, damages.
Fuckoff and die, all of you fuckin' idiots Black Block.

Black blocks have ruined the pacific acitons of these days and have a big responsability in the damages and in the violent atmosphere that has caused the death of Carlo Giuliani

The Genoa Black Block article by alien8 describes a specific microcosm; yet this is mirrored in the general macrocosm. Any group of people who come together for a common purposes only thinly disguises the myriad of personal agendas present. As situations and circumstance become squeezed by Hazard, those personal agendas take on a greater importance... and the inevitable fractionation occurs. This is simply an aspect of the human condition.

"Are you the People's Jewdian Front or the Front of Jewdian People?" as Monty Python observed.

The issue at hand, however, is that the extreme factions become a visible target for the (varying) agendas of the opposition, and the media machines. The loose aliance of the whole becomes (delibereately) tainted by images of the tight extremist factions. In this way, Genoa in a day mirrors the ageless conflicts of the world at large.

Fact and fiction have always been odd bedfellows, each being the flip side of the other. Is it, therefore, any surprise that the facts, such as they are, become twisted into fiction and myth for each side's benefit? And let us not forget that The Global Protest Movement itself thrives on mythos and fiction (which comprise its justification) every bit as much as The Guardian's of Global Capitalism.

And when we have all understood this, the propoganda wars may stop, and the real issues debated. Until then, violence (of all sorts for all sides) will remain the norm.

You all so called pacifists are mindless. For decades you gave nothing to thw social liberation. You only enforce domination. The murderers are fully armed, killing etc. and you speak as if they were human.
You so called anarchists must decide. The social liberation struggle is not a fiesta. It costs. An you, who are ready to lick the cops, stop blaming those fighters for social freedom.
And you, who speak about violence,in general, are completely blind, so you can't see the everyday violence of state and capitalism.

Maybe I could agree on targeted property destructions.
Maybe I can believe that "When talking about "the Black Block", it is important to define WHICH Black Block we mean. The majority of Black Block demonstrators target specific property but do not enagage in random destruction. Certainly, the vast majority of Black Block demonstrators are NOT infiltrators!"

But I think right now all of this sounds kinda like bullshit, seen that as usual have the only effect of helping Berluska and his fascist friends to find more excuses for repressions.

I wonder how will be the life of squatted places after this ..

The Black Bloc is dying. It has become too easy to manipulate. I was once incredibly supportive and even participated in this tactic.

All that I can say is, all the anarchists in the Black Bloc who had common sense not to destroy local businesses and property, and to graffiti their messages rather than setting up or falling for easy traps, need to reform.

The Blue Bloc? The White Bloc? Then the next protest, all the police agents will be much easier to spot, while if others act like mindless thugs in the new bloc, they would be committing acts against the intentions of that bloc, putting much more accountability on them. No accountability, no ethics = mess waiting to happen. Way too easy for infiltrators to fuck over.

esiste un sito ufficiale dei black block?
me lo segnalate per favore???

THE COPS are the ones beating our comrades in the streets, they are the MURDERERS, they have the guns, and the tear gas, and the batons, and the riot gear. Blaming the Black Block for the violence is ridiculous. Property destruction is just a pretext, if it wasn't that the pigs would have found, or created another reason to attack. They have the numbers, they are armed against a crowd that has stones at best, they are scared and itching to show how powerful they are.
Don't be a fool, the Black Block is not the enemy.
It's the PIGS with the guns and the riot gear!
And if property destruction hurts the capitalist pigs where it hurts the most -- in their wallets -- then GO FOR IT! SMASH IT DOWN!
The pigs are the enemy, and we have been at war for a long time. Just until now, other oppressed peoples were the victims.
Solidarity!

I defend anybody's right to defend themselves against police violence and can understand the frustations and anger which lead to activist violence.
We must not provoke the police, we can only overthrow the system with the majority of people. A minority of violent protestors cannot otherthrow capitalism and can act as a deterant for many sympathisers and justify further police repression. The violent tactics we have seen within the black bloc are counter-productive and lead to the defeat of the 1968 movement.

if the majority of the black bloc doesn't approve of this or that, and they don't have their shit together before the bullets fly, how can they expect anyone, including those sympathetic to the cause of justice to do their thinking for them*AFTER* the fact if you can't sort out shat kind of violence yer gonna do,and your willing to do much actual thinking before hand,then it's IMPOSSIBLE to take them sriously

support the people!!
support the actions!!
support the blocks!!

black block saved me sometimes, thanks!!
disorganitation and disovediency!!

To the person who wrote that all 'violents' must die really needs to put things into perspective.
First, the Black Bloc has not ever killed a single person. Our brother who died yesterday was
killed by the italian paramilitary police. The state, private power, and the cops who protect them
kill countless numbers of people. Don't you think that the presence of thousands of riot cops,
paramilitaries, and the authorities scaring away the locals is violence, terrorism and a provocation. Their
whole existence is rooted in violence. Also, once knowing the level of state repression/murder, and not doing
anything about it, and even persecuting those who do fight, ARE, by default, guilty of sanctioning the
deaths of many innocent people. There is no such thing as being neutural or objective, because when
you pretend to do so, you are simply reinforcing and reproducing the dominant order. Also, if you have
been paying attention, you would have seen that from SeattleN30 till Genoa, There have been numerous
times when the police attacked and gassed "non violent protesters".
Get a CLUE dude and turn that anger you have (its obvious) agaainst the black block into something
more productive than dogmatism. I have a name for people like you: AUTHORITARIAN PACIFIST!

the black block saved me from getting creamed by the police in seattle.
they also limit the amount of teargas that pacifists have to inhale.

Be it as it may, there are some among us who either thrive in situations of violence, or at least know how to handle them in one way or the other ... the other side has them too ... in their world those people are called police, guards and soldiers, they supposedly provide something called public security.

So the thing we need to do is to organise with the black block people so they protect the other protesters from violent police action - which is a given fact with or without violent action to spark it off - and FIGHT BACK!!!

If we ostracize them and let ourselves be manipulated by the mainstream paradigm into believing that those people are harful to our cause, we will lose. They'll track us, round us up and arrest us if they can't keep us away with repression anyway.

Ask yourself, every one of you who is against violence, who will hold the police back for you to get away safely if there's no black block activists?

this-is-in-response-to-the-completely-illogical-and-downright-idiotic-comment-made-by-some-pacifist.--Violence-exists,it-has-always-existed,and-as-long-as-the-state-exists,it-will-continue-to-exist.--Non-violence-is-NOT-a-tactic,-it-is-not-a-choice.--It-is-a-front-for-cowardice.--If-we-are-serious-about-creating-a-true-anarchist-society,-we-have-to-realize-that-the-state-will-use-all-means-available-to-defeat-us.--Let-me-assure-everyone-that-ALL-peacefull-tactics-are-no-match-against-a--professional-army-with-ground-attack-aircraft,-battle-tanks,etc.--sit-ins--cannot-win-a-class-war.--this-state-repression-is-just-the-beggining.--we-have-to-be-getting-ready-for-a-war

Hurrah for the Black Bloc! They are the only ones (in past actions) who have un-arrested people!

I agree to deconstruction. How many people have been killed by police, secret-agents and fascists? And I don´t remember one case of a person killed by the "black block". This discussion about violence leads to no point and only helps the state, the politicians and its media who wants to divide the movement.
And for example in Germany where are nearly each day fascist marches, protected by the police and the law, militant antifascists and Autonome are confronting the Nazis and the police without fear of their own health. Thanx to them!
So if you attack capitalism you must be consequently, this is not a party -- the real violence and agression comes from the system!
Fight fascism - smash capitalism

That anyone would still be defending violence at this point is a depressing reminder of how far we have to go!

The writer unwittingly accepts the paradigm which underlies the political and social structures we are trying to change. Using the violence of your opponent to justify your own violence simply reinforces the idea that violence is a legitimate way of exercising political control.

The distinction the writer makes between "working class" violence and "ruling class" violence is academic. The question is not whether one is more justified than the other. They *both* feed the cycle of escalating violence. We cannot expect the police to end that cycle, since they are responsible for maintaining the status quo, and the status quo is one in which violence permeates our social, political and economic relationships (as the writer correctly observes). What we *can* do is change the "climate" in which they operate. Our tactics should be ones which the police are incapable of dealing with. Our goal should be to make the police literally useless.

Violence is something the police know how to deal with. It is the nail to their hammer. It is the reason they wse (e.g. in Prague) agents provocateurs to help get the action going. If the police are inciting the same behavior the black-bloc advocates, doesn't that tell you something? You are playing right into their hands!

One thing is clear. Violence is *worse* than ineffective. It is counter-productive. It actually moves us backward, away from the goals its proponents espouse. Our best efforts at this point should be focused not on the G8 or the WTO, but on our own tactics and our mutual understanding of what we are attempting to do.

So I favor *sharpening* the division between the small number advocating violence and the rest of us. Not by blaming the black-bloc, but by inviting friendly confrontation with them, dialogue and debate. Somewhere there is common ground. But we won't find it by sweeping our differences under the rug, or looking the other way, or name calling, or denying responsibility, or rationalizing our emotional reactivity. Let's not be afraid to take this issue on!

I think it is inevitable that as non-violent activists increasingly take responsibility for their own actions we will be forced to acknowledge our indirect complicity in the actions of the black-bloc. Out of that realization, I hope, will come a deeper understanding of what is, and is not, effective, and a *genuine* solidarity among people who are serious about change.

Look, Anarchists have a different theory of history, social change and revolution than the rest. The movement is complicated. Some Social Anarchists have more in common with Trots than with lifestyle anarchists, if only they could get rid of the Marxist baggage about objective conditions and the inevitablity of revolution. Anarchists know, unlike the liberals, social democrats, and marxists that it isn't just "corporations", it's the State too. Anarchists also know that, unlike the others, that you don't wait around for the revolution or else great social forces will calcify and their leadership will regain control and form a parasitic relationship to the State. This does mean that every moment is a revolutionary moment but it does mean that you must confront the State to test potential moments and as a component to the building of a mass movement. I am a member of an Anarchist group in my area and we have been saddened, frustrated and inspired by the events in Genoa. What some anarchists don't understand yet is that the tactics need to be diversified for maximum rhetorical effect and to mimic anarchist principles. This means violent confrontation sometimes and at other time non-violent confrontation (Gandhi was an Anarchist too,if sketchy about certain political decisions). Anarchists believe in direct democracy in all economic and political affairs. This means they value highly debate and words. However, they also understand that under imperialism and capitalism the State will not fall without direct confrontation. No anarchists should be attacking the rank and file of the social democratic groups nor should there be other random violence. Instead they should only be defending themselves and others, concentrating violent action in breaking into the red zone in the demands of popular democracy, in an effort to challenge those G8 leaders to a debate. And when they refuse, then they have missed an opportunity, and take a beating/killing from the cops. This could be their first warning. Maybe one more and then fire back. Most people respect such principled action. Social Anarchism is the present and future of true revolution. Direct Democracy is what the Liberals, Communists, Maoists and Trots have always betrayed.

1. The club of G8-rulers are the gangleaders of the murderers that have our planet in their grip. Thousands of kids dying of curable diseases every day, people driven to suicide by unbearable conditions in your neighborhood, people killed in car crashes, the whole globe held to ransom by carbon dioxid polluters, all our life in the grip of capitalism.
One of these murders happened on the streets of Genoa on Friday, in plain view for the whole world to see - Carlo hit by two bullets in the head and run over by a jeep, executed for attempting to throw a fire extinguisher at those who were protecting the warlords.
The violence of the black block pales into nothingness compared to the Business As Usual of these mass murderers.
2. Hundreds of millions of people, literally, around the globe identify with the protests and their aims and will not hesitate to defend them against the armies of the powerfull and against their propaganda onslaught.
Unfortunately billions more do not. They too are discontented but cowed into believing that there is no alternative.
Still, it is their discontent of which the 200,000 in Genoa were but the spearhead. It is them the bastards are afraid of and are throwing bones to - aid for Africa, some funds against AIDS, some cosmetic percentage of carbon dioxid less(?).
3. Now, did the black block(s) contribute to the struggle against the overlords? Nope. It is just desperate phantasizing to claim that their actions will "hurt the capitalist pigs" (quote "flamma"). In a week, everything will be back to normal in Genoa for them. Our asset is NOT to hurt them by smashing some windows, that is just ridiculously ineffective. (In that regard - spraying a message on the window is 100 times more effective - it reaches millions of viewers and can't be distorted like the message of a broken window or burnt out building.)
Our asset is to draw in more hundreds of millions of people. But burning Fiat cars and smashing residents' windows will help to prevent exactly this from happening.
4. I think it is about time the black block people realised who they are up against. Do you really think you will smash Corporate Capitalism by going from town to town smashing up their shops? It won't happen in three livetimes!
No, we have to TAKE OVER! People in McDonalds themselves have to take over and smash Ronald into pieces! Imagine next time not just cab drivers will be on strike but the building workers who had to put up the barrier for the Red Zone too. Landless peasants in Brasil squatting LAND, now that is the way forward, not just ramshackle houses, but their VERY LIVLYHOODS.
O.K., this won't happen everywhere tomorrow, but the seeds for it to happen are there in every collective disobedience against our boss, in every doubt about the legitimacy of their rule.
So comrades, get your perspective right and find a mechanism of how to control the macho instincts of some of your followers.

www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/8039

It is a polic choice to attack the pinks & whites, not caused by the Bloc. Do not waiver.

please, dont follow spectacle. this is both to blak blok (whatever is this) and to there criticals. black block, or blocks, must think about the compromised situation that they create for other people that are not pacifists but not violent. please, dont became pacifists but rethink your strategies and tactics, because they are dangerous for other militants, and even worse, for yourself. Be care of yourself.
And some criticals must rethink too. its easy to equalize violence from state and from the BB, but this is bullshit. its not the same. of course you have the rignt to be angry about BB and the situation they help to build, but they are not the same thing of police. I am angry too, but i recognice the difference.
Anyway...after Genoa we all must to discuss and debate more and more and more and more...because we are many worlds in one world. And BB is our world too.
But one cuestion to BB: how do you think the other people is? I mean, the revolutionary people that have differences with your means of faight?

I think that all pacifists need to remember that 6 million people died in concentration camps-mostly because they felt that passive resistance was the way to defeat the nazi's. wake up and fight for change.

anarch rule 1; only consensus destruction
how to?...?????????

the only good fascist is a DEAD FASCIST..... TODOS SOMOS MARCOS

Since I am in genoa and thus a witness to most of these events and since i know anarchists- friends of mine- which participated with the black Block demonstration i am able to confirm that division between some of the Black Blocks who were there in the objective to engage into targetted destruction and others who were probably ( unfortunatly ) there to break everything and create a climate of harsh violence. The later group seem to be in connection with the police because as they burnt cars and smashed the windows of small shops ( owned by genovese ) the police made no attempt to stop them . On the other hand , they charged peaceful protesters and beat them heartily.

Condannare la violenza come tale non ha valore di grande argomentazione, perchè è vero che tranne casi rarissimi la violenza in tutte le sue più striscianti forme è stata ed sembra ancora essere, purtroppo, il motore della storia. Forse ogni cosa nuova ha bisogno di nascere insieme ad un atto di distruzione che sia reale o simbolico, demonizzare non serve, occorre piuttosto sforzarsi di capire; i black block fanno pensare a molte aree di emerginazione (emerginazione relativa quale quella dei ricchi G8) in cui hanno agito in questi anni, senza che nessuno se ne sia poi particolarmente preoccupato. Parlarne, informare sul loro operato, sui loro obiettivi può essere un modo per comprenderne le ragioni, capire chi sono, come nascono ed agiscono, è anche un modo per arginare le violenze che potrebbero venire.

I am in mourning. It's so fucking sad that a protestor is dead. But stop to think...

Can we control the police? No. So why rant about their bad behaiviour. We who have seen their repressive side know how they act.

Can we control ourselves? Yes. So that is what we should do! If we act in one way the police responds in a certain way. If we act another way they respond differently.

So who do we change, the police or ourselves? Ourselves of course.

The Black Block (BB) has to see that their methods are no more effective than the methods of the people they critizise. The BB-people who "target" property makes it easy for those who just want to destroy in general. The destroy/beat-the-police-fraction of BB makes it easy for the police to attack all protestors and get away with it.

And BB actions must be very easy for the police to infiltrate. And police provocateurs always want more violence, not less. So be mindful of most violent protestors, they are often the least revolutionary.

And BB-people: Of course the police is responsible for Carlos death, but you helped create the tension that made it happen, whether you wanted to or not. This is a fact!

You have to think about and reevaluate your methods. They may seem radical but there are much more radical groups in Genua. They may seem revolutionary but there are much more revolutionary groups in Genua. They may seem anarchist, but there are much more anarchist groups in Genua.

I think Black Blockers have to face the fact that, after Genoa, their tactic has proved to have failed:
1. the "diversity of tactics" has been narrowed to one: street-fighting or, even worse, narrow property damage. (what happened to unarresting people?)
2. property damage has gone from being targeted to being general, has gone from political statement to depoliticised looting.
3. the effect, far from being attractive/radicalising/inspiring, has only damaged what little unity the movement overall had, polluting the sea that the BB swims in.
4. the whole thing has become easy for police to mimic, making it tailor-made for the actions of agents provocateurs.
Time to rethink the tactic, dudes.

hehehehehehe...... we are those who you trust and tell others of your actions before they happen...

It is interesting how INDYmedia has creatively manipulated this information over the last couple of days.

In a previous post on this very website, you showed the same images at different sizes that prove that the man throwing the red tank is not the man killed by police. First of all, the man throwing the tank is in a white tank top t-shirt and (in your previous re-sized image) gray pants. The dead man in the street (in your previous posted images) was WEARING a black jacket, and dark blue pants. Now, in your later images, you have cropped out the gray pants of the red-tank-thrower, and removed an intermediate picture that shows the dead man WEARING the jacked. Pretty convenient, I say.

Did the man throwing the red tank have time to put on a jacket and change his pants before dying like a dog in the street? Or, are you manipulating the images to attempt to get a point across.

You call yourself INDYmedia, and may be independent of the major media sources, but this does not, obviously, prevent you from being biased, and untruthful, and manipulative. Try again next time.

I spent three hours getting through the city on friday to reach the pinks. That meant going through the are the black bloc were smashing up and burning down. i saw them then and the next day when they fought with police. But I haven't them since - not on buses, in the imc, travelling about. unfortunately being a peaceful protester with very different ideas and tactics I rarely get to hang out with people that would be in the black bloc. Can someone who knows more please tell me. Which nationality are most of them? What is their political stand point? Are they organised in any way? How do they justify burning cars and smashing traffic lights (I saw this happen)? I'm interested, please tell me.

I think that the idea of the violent action as a revolutionary one is a real very very old idea. It was the idea of Ravachol, Henry, and others that don't came to the result of Anarchy or at least some social reform, but only to repression indiscriminate of the state against the oppositors.
Last days in Genova it was the same thing.
Then, this groups are easy to infiltrate. there are news of nazi militant of "forza Nuova" who smashed window etc to create chaos. and some policemen too!
at the end, this groups are useful to the system they declare (honestly, I think) to fight.

The problem whether to approve or to criminalize the so-called "black bloc" is extremely urgent within the movement. I hope no "final decision" is taken, to mantain the protests open to all kind of positions. In Prague, for example, the black bloc protested in his way, without interfering with the pacifists. I hope that in the next demonstrations it will not happen again what we saw in Genoa, where violence spread also in the pacifist demonstration. It's very important that who has the intention to destroy banks and mcdonalds keeps doing it, but avoids having pacifists pay for his/her actions. I think all kind of protests have the right to express themselves (obviously!!!), but each of them should take the responsibility for its actions. Police strategy in Genoa was obviously aimed at pushing violent groups (filling them up with infiltrates!) towards the pacifists, and having violence grow without control, to shift public and media attention on violence rather than on the 300.000 pacifists. Let's not get trapped in their dirty trap!!!!!

As I see it, there are two directions the black bloc can go. The direction it is currently headed in is that of disentegration...not only of itself, but of the Movement as a whole. Although in some minds trashing of banks and corporate holdings is damaging capitalists, it does no harm to capitalism. Actually, the only party harmed aside from the Movement is the insurance companies. But this unfocused trashing of corporate targets of opportunity has led to a more general trashing of any target of opportunity - be it corporate or not. Doubtless, a portion of this activity is the action of agent-provocateurs, but it is foolish to think that some mindless destruction is not being carried out by individuals whose only allegence is to themselves, or perhaps people who don't have much of a clue and think all vandalism is good for the Movement. This has a crippling effect on how the world interprets the anti-globalisation/anti-capitalist message. Hoodlums. Vandals. Not revolutionaries. Not people make a statement...just people making a mess.

And so the other blocs are thinking of disowning the black bloc. Feeling that if only the world didn't associate the black with the white or the pink or the purple polka-dotted, then their message would be heard. And the state encourages this split. The state says 'how can you expect us to take you seriously when you allow these beasts to represent your movement? When you "harbour" them?' And say the schism occurs. Well. That's the end of the Movement. Think for a minute. If the state wants it, it can't be a good idea. Without the black bloc or something similar, the state can concentrate it's energies on the rest of the Movement. Divide and conquer - that's their motto, and it works.

Now, here's the other direction the black bloc can take. Stop trashing banks. Stop trashing mcdonalds. nike. And for all you idiots out there who've been trashing cars and small businesses - Stop it! If you support the Movement, stop. There is so much more the black bloc can be doing. There was a time when the black bloc unarrested fellow protestors. Let's have more of that. You want to clash with police...fine. But make those clashes meaningful. Protect your more passive protesting brothers and sisters from baton charges. You gotta trash something? Okay, but limit it to state property damage and only when necessary as a diversionary tactic to take some of the heat off of another body of protestors. Don't be putting peaceful protestors in harms way by your actions except in the aformentioned case of a baton charge where action is necessary to protect. Protect. If the black bloc's focus shifts to protection of the Movement...of the message, then it will rise from the ashes. If you see someone trashing indiscriminately, try to put a stop to it. Discourage anything but focused and purposeful diversionary vandalism against the state. Because the state is the real enemy. Without it, the corporations wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Sure, the corporations are bleeding the people dry, but it is the state that has made it all possible.

I have been wondering if it would be possible for the followers of destruction, in the name of the war against global capitalism, to take their way of protesting away from massive organised demonstrations.
Everyday you can get a group together to smash multinational corporation things up. It doesn't have to be during a gathering of pacifist demonstrators.
There is even less police presence around when there is no other activity around. So the black block should be able to smash things in peace. Or do members of the black block believe themselves to be real anarchists if they get into the media?

Do you remember to old saying about the kung-fu man who aims at the space behind the rock when he/she is going to break the rock with a hit?

I belief the black block are rubbing themselves against the rock instead of aiming to smash it.

FIRST BLOCK, SECOND BLOCK-- who cares if you are unmasked and honest?


GANDHI didn't wear a mask--

He made himself known and allowed the full weight of the state to fall on him to make his point.

MARTIN LUTHER KING didn't wear a mask--

he believed so strongly in his truth that he sacrificed his life for the movement.

YOU PEOPLE give anarchism a bad name.
I think that you actually are cops trying to derail a real, global, nonviolent movement.
Take the masks off or stay home you cowards!

What can I say: If you are to have non-violent action than it is imperative that the "violent" acts of groups like the "Black Bloc" must have its place. This is the balance which keeps the elites off balance. As you have learned they have overwhelming force and they are showing you all that they will use it. Therefore you all must embrace your forces and the skills which each side employs(sports enthusiast understand this though not most lefties): violent forces MUST be given "cover" by the non-violent forces; the so-called violent troops can only be trained by contact with this "overwhelming force"(support well-armed militia) inorder for the its overthrow.(Read about the cuban revolution for historical perspective).
Throughout time it is a combination of means, especially so-called violent tactics which ushers in the next age: 1776-1783(American Revolution); 1860-64 The overthrow of Chattel Slavery; the Russian liberalization movement needed 36 years 1881-1917 from the death of Alexander II at the hands of Anarchists, to the storming of the Winter palace in St. Petersburg, Russia to bring about a "new" order. This debate is so tiring; lastly, never become fixed in what others need to do but on what YOU can do to progress as a "cell" in the body called society... see you in the hills and mountains!

The majority of the black bloc have my support. i understand the anti-violence sentiments, but directed property damage (not violence, their is a huge difference) has a legitamate purpose. If only the windows of multinational corporations and banks were broken it would be much more difficult for the media to slander the destruction. This is an area in which grafiti does wonders. A picture of a smashed building includes the grafiti on it. Get the message across any way possable. A picture of a broken bank and a well thought out phrase may just make someone think.


In the very least, please try toaccept different tactics. Both militant and peaceful tactics are working in a positive direction.

I think the only reason why black blocers have been so ineffective and counter-productive in Genoa is that they didn't know that the state would react as violently as it did. Black bloc violence is counter producive for our movement only when the state is using more violence. Do you think that if black blocs defeated the police and breached the wall, we would be there wondering if black blocs can be fruitful for our cause. They were, they are and they will be of a great importance in the struggle.
In Seattle, this is not the pacifists who succeeded in canceling the meeting, but the actions of black blocers, but there, black blocs was then an unknown tactic for the state and the police was quite lost about it all.
In Quebec City, the black blocs were effective in tearing down the wall, but the state already knew a little about them and had already thought of a strategy to piss down the revolution that was beginning:divide and conquer. So every time black blocs were trying to rip the wall down, the police shelled the peaceful protesters with tear gas. It was violent, but nothing within reach of what happened this weekend. But in spite of this, the movement remained united.
In Genoa, i think that everyone was kinda surprised by the violence used by the police and that's why we are here today debating. They saw in quebec that it's not tear gas canisters that will divide us, but way more painful and killingful baton charges and guns. And it seems to work! But where there was a total lack goodwill on the side of the police is that they just repressed the group of the majority peaceful and not the ones that defended themselves, FUCKING COWARDS PIGS!

It's like we were in a history class(history is fun, but the teacher's always boring as hell) and a students shouted bad words to the teacher cuz he was stupid and then, the stupid instead of just punishing the unruly student punished very severly all the others so that they will all be really angry at the kid that had just said what everybody was thinking. I agree, the story is pathetic, my storytelling skills are far from just good, but this is what it makes think, what happened in Genoa, cause it happened to most people that went to school. Terrible mass control technique orchestrated by evil teachers.

An important point is that the black bloc tactics need to evolve as do the police ones. The advantage of the black bloc is that the state is reactionary and very slow to understand, but they do learn. Diversity of tactics is what makes a black bloc very effective, but that's not what we have seen in the streets of Genoa.
And to all peaceful hippies out there who are angry against black blocers, you're right to be, after what happened in Genoa, they acted like cowards, letting you suffer when they knew that peaceful hippies would not defend themselves against a baton charge and that they had to be the target. You may think they are arrogant in saying that this is their work that allowed you to be this far, but this is true. If you wanna fight a martyr war, go, but don't cry on your dead. If you don't want to fight back, then this will end up in a genocide. I beleive that one alive anarchist as we're all worth a billion dead ones. Gandhi... is dead.
And one more thing, please overcome your differences cause that's exactly the main target powerful corporate suckers want to exploit cause it seems it is our weak link. We are under a major attack, so courage will be of a great importance if you wanna win the battle.

We must not question "how high" when they order us to "jump" or we are all dead with "a bullet in our head".

noitarebil wrote:
"Non-violence-is-NOT-a-tactic,-it-is-not-a-choice.--It-is-a-front-for-cowardice"
Obviously noitarebil knows his history...
I just hope noitarebil is atually a cop, trying to provoke reactions and pull in a few idiots, and is not sincere. It would be too pathetic....

When I first read the media coverage of Seattle I was angry with the Black Bloc for creating a media focus on a few incidents of 'wanton' property destruction instead of on our message. In dc at a16, I chided a Black Bloc member near me when she kicked at the window of Fidelity Investments---I could already hear the radio and TV "journalists" soberly recounting a few broken windows.

However, I realized that the Black Bloc performs an important function that benefits all protestors. While the rest of us may march forward defiantly in one long procession (sitting ducks easily disabled!), the black bloc sets up diversions, barricades and targeted blocs. For those of us involved in direct action, like trying to stop a meeting, the black bloc's guerilla tactics and willingness to put themselves on the line makes us more effective. When we can't have swarming helicopters to chart the police presence in a city, the black bloc has radio transmissions alerting us to danger spots.

A lot of the fuss over the black bloc has to do with media hype and the bad image the black bloc brings to the movement. Realize that if the media were not decrying the black bloc's actions they still would not really listen to our arguments and causes. If we are not "violent black-clad rioting anarchists" then we are a hippie-esque puppet-wielding coalition of goofy causes that doesn't understand international economics.

I do find any violence against police or other individuals unacceptable. I personally have never witnessed such violence, but if it happened in Genoa it is deplorable. At all of the protests in the US I have attended, the only "violence" I have seen was property destruction and yet the black bloc still gets flack--because of the bad press (I believe). We are all in this together. We are all the black bloc. Let us not be divided by tragedy and the corporate media machine.

As i see it right now, violence is not furthuring your cause. i think it is fairly obvious that the people of the world dont support fighting cops and throwing firebombs, or even the idea that capitalism is bad, for that matter. how do you plan on carrying out a revolution without the support of the people? it just wouldnt happen, now, would it? however, the people dont support entirely peaceful protest either. then, you would just be a bunch of hippies. I think, for the time being, the black bloc, and all protesters for that matter should be trying to get the support of the people, through rallies, speeches, etc, basically trying to turn the people on to your ideas. when the majority of the pupulation is against capitalism, then is the time for truly violent protest. as it is right now, the so called "violent" forms of protest i support is the spraypainting of slogans on walls, a much clearer message than a broken window, the un-arresting of protesters, and the breaking down of walls designed to keep you from being heard. save the throwing of firebombs and fighting police for when you actually have a chance of succeeding, beacuse the rest of the world will be down there fighting with you!

The easiest why to stop a evergrowing movement: hire a dozen deliquants, make them smash some windows. Here comes the tear gas! Most of the people run home, the media only shows the material destruction (the general public indentifies itself with McDonald's), about no word comes out of the talks except that they care for the same things as the protesters, my ass! A millionaire who profits from a system that feeds from the poor never will want a change to that system.

I was in Québec last april, no so called "Black Block" had anything to say. People screamed at them, you could see that they had no affinity with the real protesters. Worst of all, the riot police waited for the B.B. to leave before gasing us. Plus I never once saw a B.B. near the "Wall of shame".

I don't believe the B.B. really exists, maybe it did once, but what I saw in Québec were undercover cops.

Yves, what you have seen in Quebec City differs completely from what i have seen there. I saw black blocers rip down the wall at a dozen of places, but what's the deal to throw tear gas cans in a crowd full of black blocs when you know it's gonna be tossed back. And every time a black convoy arrived at a place, people did not shout at them, but cheered them on. Let me tell you that it was a marvelous display of anarchism, they were too well organized for the pigs. Black blocs really worked in quebec city! But it's the people in the streets that did not work. If you look in a lot of tourism mag across america, you may see and read that Quebec City is the best place to live to raise a family according to their values. Very low criminality rates for a city this size (500000), there is not more poverty and the cost of living is also very low. It's good for the living, but very bad for the character. The protest in Quebec would have been a frank success if all people passed through the wall, now down, and gathered in front of the congress center. But that is not what happened, people were to afraid to eat a baton charge like our brothers in Genoa did even if at that time, we were like 10000 against 10 cops. But that's not surprising when the great majority of young people (75%) that came to the protest live in comfortable homes that were more worried about the city image than what they went fighting for.(i live there so i know what i'm talking about)

Yves, what you have seen in Quebec City differs completely from what i have seen there. I saw black blocers rip down the wall at a dozen of places, but what's the deal to throw tear gas cans in a crowd full of black blocs when you know it's gonna be tossed back. And every time a black convoy arrived at a place, people did not shout at them, but cheered them on. Let me tell you that it was a marvelous display of anarchism, they were too well organized for the pigs. Black blocs really worked in quebec city! But it's the people in the streets that did not work. If you look in a lot of tourism mag across america, you may see and read that Quebec City is the best place to live to raise a family according to their values. Very low criminality rates for a city this size (500000), there is not more poverty and the cost of living is also very low. It's good for the living, but very bad for the character. The protest in Quebec would have been a frank success if all people passed through the wall, now down, and gathered in front of the congress center. But that is not what happened, people were to afraid to eat a baton charge like our brothers in Genoa did even if at that time, we were like 10000 against 10 cops. But that's not surprising when the great majority of young people (75%) that came to the protest live in comfortable homes that were more worried about the city image than what they went fighting for.(i live there so i know what i'm talking about)

A quibble with the heading "The mother of all idiots is always pregnant". How about the father of all idiots won't wear a rubber? How about patriarchy and the male-dominated culture of violence have created this violent,greedy mess that we call planet earth? That heading really hurt me as a woman - felt like I was kicked right in the womb by some jack-booted soldier. Pregnant women create and nurture life and should be honoured. Please be mindful of your language.

The Black Bloc(s) aren't thinking very clearly, and certainly not uniformly, and the variety of their behavior shows it. Some BBs breaking big corporate windows, some breaking everything in sight. Some trashing cars, and some trashing peaceful protesters. Some randomly running about, while some manouever with military precision.

Starhawk's article asked how they were so well armed, so well coordinated, and so well hidden after the action? Good questions, and all of them coming right to the issue of police infiltration. Perhaps even police cooperation. It only takes a few leaders to make a deal: "we'll make the hippies look silly and give you a reason to beat them up, and we'll also break some windows so you can be the protectors of big and small businesses alike, and you leave us alone and we'll leave you alone -- after all, we both know that violence and might makes right, right?"

Anarchism is a very principled and ethical position, and asks that each person behave in the best possible way so that we can all have the best possible world. Anarcho-fascism is a thug's code for breaking and taking whatever is attractive at the moment if you have the power to do so.
The BB obviously hasn't sorted this out yet, despite the intelligent and impassioned statements of a few thinkers. Their direct actions, at least in Genoa, are all over the map.

The neat thing about refusing to accept violence as a tool or tactic, is that you can instantly label anyone who proposes a violent action as being a cop. If you make it a rule, as many groups in the 60's did, you keep police infiltration to a minimum, and force the press to sound really silly if they try to blame you for being dangerously nonviolent.

With the BB making violence "acceptable," they also open themselves up to infiltration and even control by the very powers they want to defeat. So long as they only break windows, the BB will be living off of the power generated by the nonviolent protesters, and demonstrating no meaningful power of their own.

Now if they covered Nike's windows with a giant photo of the inside of a sweatshop, or covered McDonalds with a picture of rainforest destruction or a slaughtered cow, that would be revolutionary. Especially so if the picture was not removable from the window, and Nike and McDonalds had to break it themselves! Epoxy and plastic sheeting in prepared rolls.

Doesn't anyone remember the actions of the 60's that destroyed property with grace and humor, and made a point while doing so? I certainly remember 300 parking meters with their coin slots glued shut.

If instead, the BB remains at the mercy of anyone who wants to put on a ski mask, they will eventually become the equivalent of fascist deaths squads, bringing destruction and death to every demonstration, and serving the purposes of the powers they claim to hate. The BB has to clean up its act, before it destroys everyone else's.

Well,where can i start from?Defend violence or criticize it?I am sure it won't make a single difference.
But what i want to say is that the people who clashed with the police the second and the third day of the Genoa G8 meeting were not only anarchists from the black block or from anywhere else.They were people who broke the barriers.They broke the barriers of their parties, of their groups perhaps of their own restraining conscience.These people that everyone calls black block besides from anarchists may have been leninists, stalinists, maoists, trots,autonomists,greens or even former pacifists frustrated by police oppression.My point is that this multitude of people as Spinoza describes are the hope of this Movement against Neoliberal Globalisation.I dont mind if they are one of the above as long as they are against Neoliberal Globalisation.After all this is a movement that contains many fractions.The media played the game of "bad" BB and "good" pacifist demonstrators.They did that for two reasons:
1.They understood immediatelly that the biggest threat posed to the G8's world dominance was this embryo of the World Community that was formed in Genoa during these clashes.It was the easiest way to present it as the BB in order to polarize the movement into violent and non-violent demonstrators and therefore creating an asphyxiating situation for the people that broke their barriers the previous days.This could be caused pretty easily as this embryo didn't have a political umbrella or any form of "representation" (in its good form).
2.The leaders of tutte bianche like Casarini who doesn't mind being pronunciated "leader" "capo"(ego...or what else...) or Agnoletto or others made a form of political negotiation with the police.This deal with the DIGOS suggested as one Verdi congress member said in an Italian newspaper ("Manifesto" i believe)that there would be a clash and that the tutte bianche would only reach the border with the red zone and then they would leave hte site.Of course the cops aren't stupid enough to honour it and right they did from their side.Its the "leaders" that shouldn't have been so naive.In the small street that their demo was stranded by teargases it was normal for their activists to abandon them.Since a part of them joined the multitude where they could be trully effective and not restrained by a kind of mediated violence the media spotlight fell on them depriving the "leaders" from their much desired fame.In order to regain control of the situation the "leaders" denounced the clashes as being cause by the BB though it was real that the BB was only a fraction most probably less than half of the total of the people clashing and the other serious component and adequatly organised for this kind of clash were simple activists from the tutte bianche and people from other groups.With this they contibuted to the Media effort to round back into the yard the activists.
It is upon us whether they will succeed or not.As for the claims about police provocateurs inside the demo i must stress the fact that my belief is that they existed in every block violent or not.I seriously hope that the people making these claims were present during the clashes because it is obvious that police agents couldn't have used tutte biance equipments that are limited to most and are given out to specific persons.Photos can prove my case.As for the matter of violence i will only say that if we accept the theory that every social unrest is provocated by the police we must all sit home and watch "Friends" or whatever. Capitalism doesn't go down with a prayer.
P.S. Sorry for the occupied space.(anti-copyright).

As in all demonstrations, the issue of whether violent or non-violent means should be adopted is raised to the fore usually by the mass media. Confrontation sells papers and advertising space on TV so its in their interests to focus along these lines.
I prefer to scrub the whole violence question and deal with different parameters, elegance and necessity.
I believe (and have had my beliefs supported by practise) that doing what is necessary to get our point or points across in the most elegant way imaginable creates the largest comprehension and support from both within the movement and outside it.
Is it necessary to break the window of Lufthansa? If so how can it be carried out in the most elegant way possible?
We end up tearing eachother to pieces when we deal with issues of non-v/violence. Never has there been a satisfactory resolution to this debate. Why? Its a tissue tiger, an empty question, one designed to divide us.
What is the most elegant way to get the things done that is necessary to speak our message and to actually change the face of the world?
Please think about it and reply personnally to me here in East Timor.

smettetela con questo inglese! parlo un poco di francese e "l'inglese internazionale" mi sembra uno dei tanti modi ke confermano la superiorità dei costumi statunitensi sui nostri. comunque, a parte il fatto che non ho capito un cazzo (o quasi) di quanto avete scritto fino ad ora,volevo metterci qui quel poco poco che so. cioè che ho conosciuto un black blocker che mi ha detto di essere un anarchico ligure, che non era lì solo per spaccare tutto ma aveva una precisa ideologia politica, che carlo giuliani era un black blocker e che se c'erano fra loro infiltrati della police c'erano solo dopo l'assassinio di carlo giuliani,"ma pochi però". adesso, se tra quanti scrivono c'è un black..italiano, per favore esaudisca la mia volontà di conoscenza e mi spieghi chi siete, cosa ci facevate a genova e perché cazzo avete abusato del nostro corteo pacifico (la pace non può essere patologica) e reso inutile ogni ns tentativo di contrapporci alla metodologia degli otto: la violenza, che voi invece avete accolto e non solo accettato

I'm not a pacifist and I do not exclude absolutely the violence.
One of yuors said "Violence exists". You're smart ! We could never hide anything to you !
The *ONLY* reason (for me) to use violence could be *DEFENSE*. Nothing else. Why did you waste your strenght breaking windows instead protecting the pacifists ? Who do you think you have damaged ? The owner of the bank ? Lufthansa ? :DDDDD
From what I've seen you have only been useful to the domination. If this was you target you did a good work.

Io non sono un pacifista e non escludo in modo assoluto la violenza.
Qualcuno di voi ha detto: "La violenza esiste". Sei intellingente ! Non ti potremmo mai nascondere niente !
L'*UNICO* motivo per usare la violenza potrebbe essere la difesa. Perchè avete sprecato la vostra forza rompendo vetri invece di difendere i pacifisti ? Chi credete di aver danneggiato ? I proprietari della banca ? La Lufthansa ? :DDDDD
Da quello che ho visto siete stati utili solo al regime.
Se questo era il vostro obiettivo avete fatto un buon lavoro.

Sorry to disagree but there was a HUGE infiltration in Genoa.
I saw black blocks members talking to the police and i saw some of them COMING from the police ranks!!
I saw them attacking peaceful demonstrators too!
A boy who was walking with a Communist Flag was attacked and beaten up by two black blocks members who also destroyed his flag!
And how come the black blocks WERE NOT STOPPED by the police????
How come they could reach ALL of the squares of the city where PEACEFUL manifestations were taking place bringing there the police who ONLY CHARGED peaceful demonstrators and not the black blocks members?
I'D LOVE an answer thanks a lot!

reading this story, i began to feel almost as though the idea of "symbolic/tactical property destruction or violence" is a monster that has gotten out of control. I respect that there are many ways of resisting the increasing concentration of power and wealth that is occuring in our world, and i consider myself anarchist in many of my political ideas. in quebec i talked with many so called black bloc-ers, and found most of them articulate, passionate and intelligent.i considered them companeros, people who i would be proud to support. the problem is, because of the tactics that make up a black bloc (masks, everyone dresses in black)it makes it very easy for anyone to look like a member of the black bloc, even if they don't have any thought or specific political ideology behind their actions. i can debate whether or not throwing a stone through a bank window helps our movement, but the problem is that it creates a climate in which people feel free to throw stones into any window. i hate to say this, and i wish it wasn't true, but i did see people in quebec, and i'm sure there were in genoa, who had no idea why they were there and were drinking and basically wanting to stir shit up, or take out issues they had with the cops (not that the cops weren't readily into supplying issues for anyone who didn't have some before). so they dressed in black cause this way they were annonymous and could do what ever the hell they want. i don't consider these people part of the "black bloc", or even part of our movement.
but the problem is, corporate media and even some indy media immediatly brand anyone clad in black as an "anarchist black bloc-er" and judge 1)anarchy 2)the black bloc and 3)our whole movement on their actions. this also makes it extremely easy for police to and state forces to act as agent provocuers (yeah, i can't spell), and this hurts ALL of us! it also gives police an exuse to justify their violence, and it has the potential to splinter our movement and turn us against each other. and i realize that the black bloc isn't some shadowy organization and it's impossible for someone to be like "ok, we've decided that we as a movement are not going to use this tactic anymore" because we're all making our own choices here. and i for one would repectfully ask anyone who is involved in black bloc actions to think carefully exactly where your choices in tactics will lead, and what sort of a movement they're going to create. it may be time to try something new and unexpected. creativity is our greatest weapon. like it or not, all or us are in this together, from the most radical to the more moderate, and all our actions affect how this huge mix of movements that have collided into one are seen, and how violently the state will be able to repress us.

"be the change you wish to see"
-ganhdi

if police were amogst us they were there as infiltrators and not as provocateurs. We didn't need provoking, we came there with criminal intent! What is more, we had no intention of reserving our rocks for the windows of 'big' rather than 'small' or 'local' capitalist enterprise. If we did any 'targeting' it was for more practical reasons. We are anti-capital not anti-corporate. Everything is local somewhere, and by the same token, nothing is local (in the valuable sense) anywhere, because Capital is everywhere and community nowhere. Little shops can only become big shops or they will die, but as the 'local' face of the commodity they are just as repugnant, and in looting them we get a rare taste of genuine communal distribution.

Most of the stuff on this page seems to be written by people who weren't even there and are completly misinformed about the real situation. A lot of it, such as the suggestion that 'the' black block (there is no such thing)did a deal with the police, would be funny if it wasn't so revolting. As everyone now knows, it was the white overalls who did a deal with the police! Not because (as someone said here) there leadership is "nieve" but because their leadership are a bunch or bureaucratic parasites who only seek power from events like these and really don't have any problems with the police on priniciple. As I saw first hand in Genova many members of tuti bianci want to emulate the police: beating up many black blockers and ultimately forming a line accross the road stopping a very small group of anarchists joining 'their' demo. It was laughable, and our chant of 'via, via, la neuvo policia' was a joke, but think about the kind of world where people like this get in power... Not that much different from the one we have now methinks.

The fact that many members of tuti bianci broke ranks and joined the black block in attacking the police is to their credit, and to the credit of humanity's struggle against both the neo-liberal globalisation of the G8 leaders and the neo-global liberalisation of the protest leaders.

i'm from indonesian black block and work to libertarian collective . i hope free information or action report local black block from you !
thanks and respect
support your local black block and join the resistance!!!!
information send to :
ZAENAL ABIDIN
JL. BARENG RAYA 2C/410
MALANG - EAST JAVA . INDONESIA EARTH

indonesia-earth

i'm from indonesian black block and work to libertarian collective . i hope free information or action report local black block from you !
thanks and respect
support your local black block and join the resistance!!!!
information send to :
ZAENAL ABIDIN
JL. BARENG RAYA 2C/410
MALANG - EAST JAVA . INDONESIA EARTH

indonesia-earth

questo commento è stato inserito nel 2006

a distanza di quattro anni tutti dovremmo aver capito che le tutebianche non risolvon un kazzo e l'unica è abbattere il potere con la forza, attacando i suoi simboli e le sue infrastrutture.
C'E' MOLTO DA CREARE MA ANCORA I PIU' DA BRUCIARE.
i compagni del black bloc sono un bel po' più avanti rispetto al resto del movimento...
saluti anarchici e insorgenti
the mad umanoid